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posted by [personal profile] ptc24 at 11:04am on 04/05/2010
I've intentionally excluded all of the nuanced answers to the questions of human height, and provided a straight choice between two gross oversimplifications. But which do you prefer, or at any rate least despise?

Poll #3000 Stupid forced-choice poll
Open to: Registered Users, detailed results viewable to: All, participants: 16


Human height - which of these two statements is less bad:

View Answers

Men are taller than women
15 (93.8%)

Men and women are the same height
1 (6.2%)

There are 11 comments on this entry. (Reply.)
simont: A picture of me in 2016 (Default)
posted by [personal profile] simont at 10:14am on 04/05/2010
If you stood all the men in the world on top of each other in a giant wobbly tower, and all the women next to them in another giant wobbly tower, which would be taller? :-)
ptc24: (Default)
posted by [personal profile] ptc24 at 10:20am on 04/05/2010
Hmmm, with that phrasing, if there are more women (as opposed to girls) than men (as opposed to boys) in the world (given that on average women mature a little faster and live a little longer, this seems quite possible), then the female tower could actually be taller.
simont: A picture of me in 2016 (Default)
posted by [personal profile] simont at 10:23am on 04/05/2010
I had a brief go at googling up statistics that might allow me to estimate the answer, but didn't find anything that would have let me manage more than a basically random guess.
jack: (Default)
posted by [personal profile] jack at 11:24am on 05/05/2010
Wait, I remember this. People are born faster than they can climb up into a tower :)
lnr: Halloween 2023 (Default)
posted by [personal profile] lnr at 11:56am on 04/05/2010
While there's huge overlap in the height ranges of men and women, and some individual men are clearly going to be shorter than some individual women, I don't have any problem with the former statement.

Interestingly if you'd made it about, say, maths ability (or indeed anything which might involve a value judgment) I'd find an equivalent statement much more problematic.
ptc24: (Default)
posted by [personal profile] ptc24 at 12:51pm on 04/05/2010
How about physical strength? It's a trait that's much less important in our civilised, technological society, and regarded with suspicion as much as with admiration (see negative stereotypes of physically strong people as stupid, and/or violent), but it's still something that a lot of people value.
lnr: Halloween 2023 (Default)
posted by [personal profile] lnr at 01:58pm on 04/05/2010
That is indeed a difficult one. I think I don't object (too much) to anyone making the statement "men are stronger than women" in the abstract, so long as they don't then use it to say women aren't allowed to do something :)
naath: (Default)
posted by [personal profile] naath at 04:12pm on 04/05/2010
I think that (somewhat similar to the maths question) in our society men are very much more encouraged to do things to increase their physical strength and to show it off - your height is something you pretty much can't do anything about, but strength is definately under your control to some extent.

The very strongest men appear to be stronger than the very strongest women (comparing people who compete at weight lifting), but it's not clear to me how strong the "average" man and the "average" woman would be; especially if they both undertook the same amount of strength training activities.

If I were running a weight-lifting competition I would probably assume the men would lift larger weights than the women. If I wanted someone to help me lift a box I'd probably assume that my female friends are just as capable of doing so as my male friends.
tim: Tim with short hair, smiling, wearing a black jacket over a white T-shirt (Default)
posted by [personal profile] tim at 05:38pm on 04/05/2010
Samuel Delany had an essay where he said that studies that were just supposed to be about height yielded quite different results for height differences between men and women, whereas studies that measured people's heights incidentally while studying something else had results suggesting minimal differences between sexes (if any). He also points out that anecdotal experience is misleading since male-female couples are very likely (due to social pressure) to consist of a taller man and a shorter woman, and since taller women and shorter men are likely to be too ashamed of themselves to go out in public much.

Unfortunately it's hard to verify these claims, but it's interesting to think about. I think both statements are bad because the first statement implies that every man is taller than every woman, whereas the second implies that everyone is the same height.
ptc24: (Default)
posted by [personal profile] ptc24 at 09:40pm on 04/05/2010
I'm interested in what quite different results and minimal differences actually mean - whether people could say which ratios of differences-between-means to standard deviations these phrases correspond to. This is as much to do with my interest in language, in vaugeness, and the omission of qualifiers, as it is to do with any interest in sexual dimorphism.

My morning's googling revealed this which suggests that the height distribution is almost-but-not-quite bimodal, and that most people thing of height as the textbook example of a bimodal distribution. In other words, height dimorphism is "less than most people think, but real nonetheless".
tim: Tim with short hair, smiling, wearing a black jacket over a white T-shirt (Default)
posted by [personal profile] tim at 09:49pm on 04/05/2010
I'm paraphrasing, and unfortunately I don't have the book with the essay in it handy right now (I think it's in his _Shorter Views_).

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